Americanized Tantos Power

[kurodrago]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYozOCQM7CI&annotation_id=annotation_502420&feature

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TpiMUuhZS80&annotation_id=annotation_695752&feature

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_AtApX3468&annotation_id=annotation_395520&feature

[Madnumforce]

I don't think these tests are very fair. They are clearly design to see the CS tanto, with it thick, tough point win. It's clearly bad faith that the Gerber and the traditionnal tanto aren't sharpened to give significative results. I guess that any one relying on a combat knife to save his live put a razor edge on it. The snap cut on an horizontal surface is quite unrealistic, as well the straight descending motion of the "stabbing machine" against a supported target. And while the traditionnal tanto and the Gerber are clearly stabbers, the CS Tanto is primarily a slasher in my opinion. The CS tanto is overall a more utilitarian design, with increased toughness and weight, while the others are clearly exclusively combat weapons. The CS Peace Keep would have been a better comparison. But in fact, it seems to be the fault of the writers of the original article to compare things that should not have been. But it's completly silly to brag about the Yokote of the CS Tanto while the other doesn't have. Japanese weapons have taken tons of shapes trough the ages, some had extremely sharp needle point other had thick obtuse tip, and there is everything you can imagine in between. Opposing the "traditionnal tanto point", allegedly inferior, to the CS tanto Yokote tip is just plain ridiculous. In fact, Cold Steel took a traditionnal japanese tanto design, not the other way around.

And by the way, when you want a knife to cut, you can achieve it. Someone I know had some "troubles" with a weed smoker, and this day he was carrying a Victorinox Picknicker I offered him and sharpened not crazy sharp, but just to a pretty decent edge. Said weed smoker had hearphones around his neck that protected him from having these veins cut, but the long slash went from his shoulder down to his wrist, where tendons had been cut. He now bears a nice scar on his shoulder, and still can't move his fingers, more than half a year after the "encounter". Just with a 20$ Victorinox knife a bit sharpened. So it's just plain bullshit that a purpose made combat knife can't even cut through a canvas layer.

[Noss]

Well I've never been into knife fighting or had much interest in studying it since I carry a handgun and it will always be my first choice during a conflict on the streets but I have seen the damage a prisoner can do with sharpened tooth brush or other very crude weapon so I would say all the knives in this test in the hands of a person will fuck you up or kill you quick so advantage wise they will all work. The CS tanto is clearly tougher and stronger so it would be my choice out of the three.

[Madnumforce]

If I'm not mistaken, it's the Master Tanto in the video. A 300$ knife. The Gerber Mark II dagger is around 80-120$, and the Hanwei Tanto about 100$ also. In the same price range, the Recon Tanto would be more adequat.

But if I really had to have a combat knife, I would just take two good 6-7" boning knives with thick blade, partial tang and plastic handle. They're lighter than most combat knives (which allow to take two in case one breaks or bends), have non-slippery handles deisgned to be use in moist and bloody environment, are easy to sharpen, and cheap. Their primary job is precisely to cut meat and meet bones. But of course, unlike a CS Recon Tanto for exemple, you can't in anyway use it as a camp knife. In the first years of the trench war during WW1, much "trench cleaners" were using kitchen/butcher knives, some just 6", some really huge. On a flea market, I've seen a monstruous 12" or so butcher knife sold with other WW1 items, and it was completly clear, considering how it was made and the rust bites, that it was from the same era. Later came the purpose made knives, like your famous knuckle dusters with blades, the german trench knife Böker still produces, and our "LE VENGEUR".

[Noss]

If you watch this guys "Michael Janich" video here you can see how he states even the smallest simplistic blades can injure or kill so I'm not sure how he came to the conclusion that the CS tanto is inadequate at this job. I didn't read the article in question but this seems to be what he said about cold steel tantos. Sounds like he just has an axe to grind against cold steel.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PWmRWjDhYw&feature=related

[Noss]

Another thing from the CS rep reading an excerpt from the article refers to swat team use. I'm not on a swat team but I don't think a swat team would storm a building with their knives drawn and say come on bad guys lets rock. This is just a fantasy of the so called tactical mall ninja. Guns are the main weapon of choice here as it is in the military when it comes to killing bad guys or the enemy. If the article is referring to tactical utility use in regards to cutting, smashing ,prying stabling through solid objects "something I do know about from testing" then out of the three tested the CS Tanto is the clear choice here.

[Madnumforce]

Maybe he has something against Cold Steel, but maybe also the context is different. In the article (I haven't read though), it seems he was talking about a combat knife, so I guess it was for military, maybe LE officers, and it seems he was talking only about the knife itself. In the video, he's talking about self-defense, and the threat of the slightest edge, cause of course, if even a box cutter is a life threat, you need trainning, and that's what he's selling. His personnal interest in selling self-defense courses and a certain bad feeling about Cold Steel could explain this apparent self-contradiction.

But we also have to admit the Cold Steel is keen on taking the slightest word for an attack, and promptly respond excessively. I haven't read the article, I don't know this Michael Janich, but in the answer on the CS site, they say he just "knows nothing about knife fighting" and he's writing "ridiculous trash" and "enormous piece of garbage". This aggresive marketing policy is usual from Cold Steel, and could be accepted if it was 100% founded on good and objective reasons. But the methodology of their own test, with the two competitors almost not sharpened, is not fair and objective, at least in a role of a pure combat knife, so it undermines a bit their credibility.

But sure the CS Tanto is the tougher, stronger and more versatile of the three.

[Noss]

Ive heard of the author in question before. I've never paid much attention to him since it's not my scene. Anyways it looks like a cat and dog fight between the two I guess.

I don't own any of the knives in question and I don't have any dog in this fight. I was just looking at the facts based on what was presented here.


I would like to know what ads are on the same page as the article in tactical knives though. If there is a big Gerber mark II ad case closed. :D

[Madnumforce]

It's in fact quite notorious that magazines are often their "master's voices", and the master is who's holding the strings of the purse.

[kurodrago]

I think that the test is random but very fair.
Looking at the variation of both knive lengths and weights, the guillotine system test can be very trick?!
For example the Tanto is more small than mark II, which mans that the guillotine test will give more force to the tanto, becouse the space before impact is more long "more momentum= more force"
Although this video is made for Cold Steel people, The authenticity of the test is acceptable.... only & becouse is not a scientific:D

[kiah]

I don't know. If someone pulls a knife on me, no matter what it is, I'm gonna shoot 'em or run like a bitch. I have no interest in getting cut, that shit hurts.

Someone I know had some "troubles" with a weed smoker,

No need for a knife there. Just toss a bag of Funyuns and a Yoohoo on the ground and walk away.

[wildjim]

Good practical controlled test by Cold Steel. . .

I believe Cold Steel is correct in saying "Michael Janich doesn’t know squat"

I am liking the CS Tanto knives more than ever and I have confidence in the CS Tanto design since watching the video; although I hope to never use a knife in a self defense situation.

The other two knives appeared a joke (breaking and bending) compared to the CS Tanto.

[xxo]

$300 for a CS tanto? dude that's waaaay 2 much for a knife for going around stabbing ppl in the guts with. U can get a way better tanto from budK for $10....bet you could get the $10 budK tanto, some cool ninja throwing stars and pretty much everything in the whole budk catalog 4 $300 LOL.

[kurodrago]

$300 for a CS tanto? dude that's waaaay 2 much for a knife for going around stabbing ppl in the guts with. U can get a way better tanto from budK for $10....bet you could get the $10 budK tanto, some cool ninja throwing stars and pretty much everything in the whole budk catalog 4 $300 LOL.

300$ for Strider will be better? lol:D

[LoganSackett]

I don't know. If someone pulls a knife on me, no matter what it is, I'm gonna shoot 'em or run like a bitch. I have no interest in getting cut, that shit hurts.



No need for a knife there. Just toss a bag of Funyuns and a Yoohoo on the ground and walk away.

Good advice. ;)

Nobody wins in a knife fight. The guy who comes out ahead will still most likely require an immediate trip the the ER. And he's the "winner" of the fight. I want no part of that shit.

[wildjim]

$300 for a CS tanto? dude that's waaaay 2 much for a knife for going around stabbing ppl in the guts with. U can get a way better tanto from budK for $10....bet you could get the $10 budK tanto, some cool ninja throwing stars and pretty much everything in the whole budk catalog 4 $300 LOL.

Nice try SpyderHo :jerkit:

Get real!

[me2]

This whole series of tests is similar to the surveys done on why prisoners want to get out of prison. Is it really that hard to figure out that the thicker, blockier tanto will be stronger, but not penetrate as well as purpose designed, thinner, more tapered, and in the case of the Gerber, double edged blades?